Nov. 4, 2024
Are Motorcycle Prices Really Skyrocketing? Let's Find Out!
In this episode of the Throttle and Roast podcast, host Niels Meersschaert dives into the rising prices of motorcycles, addressing the common perception among riders that costs have soared in recent years. He compares 2014 and current prices for various popular brands like Harley-Davidson, Honda, Yamaha, and Ducati, revealing significant percentage increases. Niels breaks down median prices and price ranges across top brands, highlighting the factors behind these trends and examining whether the price hike is as drastic as it seems. Tune in to discover the truth behind motorcycle pricing and what it means for riders today!
Current motorcycle pricing
- Harley-Davidson
- Median: $26,000
- Min: $12,000 Nightster
- Max: $44,500 CVO Street Glide
- Honda
- Median: $7,400
- Min: $2,000 Navi
- Max: $29,000 Gold Wing Tour and CBR1000RR-R Fireblade SP
- Yamaha
- Median: $10,600
- Min: $4,700 VStar 250
- Max: $28,000 YZF-R1M
- Kawasaki
- Median: $9,400
- Min: $3,700 Z125Pro
- Max: $59,000 Ninja H2R
- Suzuki
- Median: $12,000
- Min: $5,100 GSX250R ABS
- Max: $19,600 Hayabusa 25th Anniversary Edition
- BMW
- Median: $18,000
- Min: $5,000 G310R
- Max: $33,000 M1000RR
- Triumph
- Median: $13,000
- Min: $5,000 Speed 400
- Max: $25,000 Rocket 3 Storm
- Ducati
- Median: $22,600
- Min: $12,400 Scrambler Icon
- Max: $70,000 Diavel for Bentley
- Indian
- Median: $25,000
- Min: $11,000 Scout Sixty
- Max: $42,000 Roadmaster Elite
- Royal Enfield
- Median: $5,500
- Min: $4,000
- Max: $7,150 Continental GT 650
Like for like bikes
1992 Honda XR650L was $4349 ($9800 in 2024 dollars)
2024 Honda XR650L is $7000
The bike hasn't changed at all other than colors.
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Chapters
00:00 - Introduction
00:48 - Motorcycle prices today
07:12 - What is driving prices up?
20:39 - Are prices really higher today?
24:55 - Wrap up
Transcript
WEBVTT
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Motorcycle prices are insane. The bikes are much more expensive than they used to be.
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Or at least that's what many motorcyclists say. But is that really the case?
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Welcome to the Throttle and Roast podcast. I'm your host, Niels Meersschaert. In today's episode, we'll explore the rising prices of motorcycles.
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We'll examine the factors contributing to these price increases and investigate whether the assumption that prices are indeed higher is accurate.
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Now, if you talk to most any motorcyclists today, they believe that prices have been climbing to insane levels. And if you look across a lot of the bikes that are being marketed today, especially on the upper end, which tends to get all the marketing dollars, this isn't all that surprising. For example, if we were to look at a 2014 Harley Street Glide when it was new, the MSRP on that was about 22 and a half thousand dollars, whereas today it's about $26,000 or 15% increase over the past ten years. Meanwhile, the 2014 BMW R1200GS was $16100 and the current R1300GS is about $19,000 as a starting price, and that's about an 18% increase from a decade ago. The other one that has to look at is let's look at like a base model, something that's a little bit more in the entry level, at least from some of the major manufacturers here in the United States. So in 2014, the base Harley was the ion 883 and it was available for about$9,000. And the current cheapest Harley available today is the Nightster, which is available for $12,000 or about a 33% increase in the cheapest entry to the brand. So there's no doubt when you look across the spectrum, it feels as though bikes are getting more and more expensive. Now, what we did here is I looked at all of the top brands by market share in the U.S. and I took the starting price for each of the models.
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And then I calculated out the median price and the cheapest and the most expensive of their portfolio of models that are available in the United States.
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And Harley-davidson's median motorcycle price is$23,000. And the prices range from that $12,000 Nightster that we mentioned, up to a 44 and a half thousand dollars CVO Street Glide. So it's a pretty broad spectrum under Harley's umbrella.
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Now, if we look at a couple of the other brands, the number two brand currently in the U.S. is Honda, and their median price is$7,400 with prices ranging from about $2,000 for 110 CC Navi up to $29,000 for the Gold Wing tour and the CBR 1000 RR dash r Fireblade SP that's the top two.
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Let's look at Yamaha. Now Yamaha is their median price is about$10,600 and this ranges from the$4700 VStar 250. Up to the YZFR1M at $28,000. Kawasaki's median price is $9,400 and that ranges from the Z125 Pro at the low end at $3700 up to the ninja H2 R at$59,000. Now that's a very specialty bike, so it's on the upper spectrum, but this is a pretty broad range that you'll see across most of the portfolios. Now, if we look to the next couple of brands, let's look at Suzuki. Suzuki is$12,000 for their median price and that ranges from the GSX 250R with ABS for 5100 to the Hayabusa 25th anniversary edition at 19,600. So a little bit of a smaller range in Suzuki.
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And that's probably reflective of why their median price is a bit lower. Now BMW is median price is $18,000 and this ranges from the G310R at $5,000 to the M1000RR at 33,000. But it should be noted BMW has a bit of a habit of offering a bike at a base price, which is fully stripped down. But none of those bikes are ever available in dealerships.They usually all come with the premium package, which usually adds a substantial amount on to them. So expect that certainly on the upper end of those prices, you're usually adding another 2 to $4000 to the actual sticker price of a bike.
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Now Triumph's median price is$13,000. And this ranges from the new line that they have of the 400 CC bikes all built in India with a speed 400 coming in at just $5,000 and ranging up to the rocket three storm at$25,000. Now it is a 2500 cc bike, so it is up there in terms of capacity, which makes sense for that broad spectrum. Now, Ducati is a brand that I think generates a huge amount of passion for it. They've got some beautiful looking bikes. They always are on the cutting edge when it comes to technology and as a result, their price points are going to be a little bit on the upper end of the spectrum.
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So their median price is about 22 and a half thousand dollars, and that will range from the scrambler icon on the low end at 12 and a half thousand dollars up to the diavel for Bentley at$70,000. Now, if we look at the another American brand, Indian Indian is about $25,000 as their median price, and that ranges from the $11,000 to Scout Sixty up to the $42,000 Roadmaster elite. So it seems when you look at all of those brands and those are a lot of the top ten brands that you would find in the United States, It feels like the prices are pretty high. But there is one brand, Royal Enfield, that seems to be bucking the trend. Now their median price is $5,500, with the low end being $4,000 for the Hunter 350 and their priciest bike is $7,150 for the Continental GT 650. So American manufacturers like Harley, Indian and Ducati are definitely the priciest with a median price in the mid-twenties, BMW is at 18,000. But as we said, that's probably a little bit low because the realistic sticker price you're going to find of bikes that are actually available to purchase is going to be a bit higher because of the premium packages that tend to come on. It's probably closer to about 21,000. But most surprising to me is that the most expensive Royal Enfield is less expensive than the median price of every single other brand, and their median priced bike is often less than the cheapest bike of the other brands. So they really are coming in and a tremendous value proposition. So there might be some hope for people who feel that things are getting a little too expensive. Are the prices today really out of alignment?
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This is something that I think we need to sort of dive into. So my question to you is, what is your impression of bike prices today? Text the link in the show notes and we'll share your thoughts in a future episode.
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So what is driving the prices? Well, one big category has to be electronics and tech.
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And if you look across the spectrum of motorcycles that are available, certainly in the United States today, almost every single motorcycle is going to have abs. There's a handful of of lower end models, certainly on the Honda Line with some of the mini bikes like the Navi and stuff where ABS is an option. But for the most part, ABS is available on most any bike today. Now running in combination with abs, oftentimes you'll find things like traction control added on to a lot of bikes and this is great for if you have a little bit too much of a wrist going in and adding a little too much throttle for the conditions, it can help temper that and avoid you from getting that rear end sliding out on you.
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This is usually a factor of when you have ride by wire, which is becoming a little bit more popular amongst most bikes. Now, the other one is lean, sensitive ABS and traction control. And this is sort of the next level above those. And this uses a six axis IMU put into the bike, sort of like your iPad or iPhone in that it's using the position and registering exactly where the bike is leaned, how much forward momentum is going, whether it's slowing down, accelerating, etc..
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And it will take that data to adjust how much of an intrusion into the braking and or traction control it's going to do at any given moment. Now, one other thing that's going to be another add on to some of the pricing that you'll find and this is on every single bike, it tends to be towards the European bikes, certainly the higher end ones.
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And this would be an adaptive suspension. And what this means is that there's actually a computer that is monitoring the position of the suspension in at any given moment and adapting and changing the dampening at any given moment. So if it realizes that you're riding a little bit more spirited, it'll tighten that up. And if you're maybe cruising along, it'll start to slow that down so it can actually really adjust the suspension to your needs in the moment. But it is an expense.
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You've going to have sensors, you're going to have a actuator that's going to adjust what that dampening is. So it tends to be on the upper end of the spectrum.
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Now, of course, it's been around for a while and it is actually starting to come into more of the cheaper models today would be cruise control. And of course, if you're doing a lot of highway miles, having cruise control is a tremendous, powerful advantage because it does take a little bit of that concentration off of your shoulders while you're riding long distance and even a better version of that, of course, would be adaptive cruise control. And this typically will use a radar sensor that's mounted into the front of the bike, and it's monitoring the distance from the vehicle that is in front of you. Most of the motorcycle specific adaptive cruise controls are smart enough to also register a motorcycle in front of you, whereas some cars will not. And this will allow you to set a target speed that you want the bike to be going and a following distance, and it will then adjust your speed and hit the brakes if necessary to maintain that following distance from whatever is in front of you.
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This can be a tremendous benefit if you're doing long miles and it will remove a lot of the fatigue that we typically will find of trying to hold that throttle a little bit more steady. Now, related into all these systems, they're typically dealing with radar that's along there and some of the systems will also have a side mounted and even a rear mounted radar.
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And this will give some more advanced, such as blind spot monitoring. You've probably seen this in cars where you have a little yellow light will blink onto of your mirrors. And now you're going to be actually aware that there is a vehicle that's coming on to the side of you, even if they're still in your blind spot. This also helps for collision warning. And this can have certainly on a front, one of you're coming at to rapid a speed to the object that's in front of you. But many of them are now starting to add in a rear radar, making you aware that there is a vehicle that's rapidly approaching your rear and maybe you need to move out of the way. a huge amount of tech that's adjusting some of the way in which the bike is being ridden. Now, one other one that we want to think of that's tying into how the bike rides would actually be ride modes.
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And when you have throttle by wire, this actually becomes possible. So what a lot of manufacturers are now doing is they're now having multiple throttle maps that allow the bike to have a bit of a different character depending upon the mood that you're in.
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And this can range from something that's maybe a more sedate for riding on highway or just a little bit of a leisurely ride to something that's a little bit more of a direct sporty type of a feeling. If you're in a spirited one to even something that might be a rain or an offroad mode to help you when traction conditions are even more limited. And this can actually tie in with some of the other systems where it will increase the intrusion of that traction control of that ABS.
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Based on the conditions. So there's a lot of tech that's coming together with these. Now, of course, another one that you're starting to see in a lot of certainly on the the more premium end of motorcycles would be TFT displays. In fact, if you look at most of the BMW bikes produced today other than maybe the low end pretty much every bike today has a full TFT display and they're actually really beautiful displays that give a lot of great information into them. And in fact, what some of the manufacturers are doing is using that screen to provide built in navigation.
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This built in navigation might be running from an onboard GPS or in many cases, it's actually running from your cell phone where your cell phone is running an app that ties into the computer that's on your bike and therefore displays the moving map from your phone. And that built in phone connectivity on some models such as Harley Davidson, Indian are pretty good about this as well as Honda.
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They'll usually have something like a CarPlay or an Android auto to tie into it, where some of the other manufacturers, BMW notoriously is is known for not leveraging. CarPlay right now has its own proprietary system but that built in phone connectivity is adding another capability. Now, one of the other things that's happening is sort of these more comfort oriented features. And if you have a bike that has luggage on the bike, you may feel that, you know, in the olden days we would actually have to take out a key.
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We'd have to unlock each individual bag and then lock them up again. Well, central locking is making this a little bit easier for you, and it's more like a feature that you would find on cars. But it is starting to come to the upper end of the touring bikes today.
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Also coming from the automotive world would be keyless ignition.
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the really big factor I think that helps a lot of people in here is not having to fish your keys out of a pocket keyless ignition is just looking for the key fob being present nearby. It does make it a little bit easier, but there are some worries that this can actually have a failure mode of, well, what if the key FOB stops working and then I'm stranded because I can't actually turn the bike on? So there are some people who are vehemently against having keyless ignition, Now, if you ride for an extended riding season such as here in the Northeast, I typically ride year round. So I'm going to ride when it's still very cold, well below freezing. I'll still be happy to ride so long as there's not ice on the roads. Having something like heated grips and heated seats is a big extension that can help make you still comfortable as the temperatures continue to drop. And that's becoming available on many, many more and more motorcycles today.
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And if you're riding at night, one of the biggest things that you will remember is some of the older bikes with the halogen bulbs is that the view that you got from those wasn't quite as clear. It didn't range as far as you would get with some of the modern projector type bulbs that you're going to get on most cars.
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And so using LEDs actually has given us a tremendously bright interface for what we can see on the road surface as we're going along. And some bikes even have another level on to that where they're adaptive headlights because unlike a car, which is just basically going through a turn flat, motorcycles of course are leaning, which means the position of the light is going to dip down to the inside at the corner and so bikes can actually then rotate the headlight to give a little bit more of an even field of view for the lights. And of course if you're touring and the conditions are changing, maybe it's a little bit more windy, maybe you're going up to a higher speed. Many of them are now including electrically adjustable window screens and this is going to allow a motor to drive and move the screen up or down and pretty much infinite positions in between, So this is nice to just really fine tune that windscreen as you're riding for any sort of buffeting that you can do. The next tech that really has started to show up on a lot of bikes started in the sport bike world and this is essentially a gear shift assistant. And what that means is it's going to automatically allow you to do typically it started with Upshifts where you could do them without having to use the clutch.
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So you just flip the gear lever up to go into the next higher gear and the bike will automatically adjust the throttle position because it's the ride by wire to ensure that you actually get a nice smooth shift. My 2015 S1000R actually has this on that but only for upshifts. But many bikes today are offering it also for downshifts and the bike actually blip the throttle to allow you to engage that lower gear. But it almost leads into that next gen that we're starting to see on a few bikes. Honda originated this with the dual clutch transmission that they have on some of their premium bikes, particularly on like, for example, the Africa twin.
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They've got it on to the gold wing and now we're starting to see this on a couple of other brands. So BMW has announced that certainly with when they promoted the new R1300GS adventure bike, they demoed a little bit of seeing no clutch lever on that left hand side.
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And that's going to be coming in as their automated manual transmission. KTM is doing a similar bit where their high end 1390 adventure bike is going to have the same capability of an automated manual transmission.
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So you can still have a gear lever where you're going to shift it, but there's no longer going to be a clutch. This is completely managed by the motorcycle and it becomes more similar to, let's say, a scooter where you don't have a clutch.
00:17:23.217 --> 00:19:17.179
But as opposed to being a CVT, it still is discreet gears that you can control. But it is adding into this. So that's a lot of the tech that fundamentally is adding into the cost of motorcycles. And if you're not interested in a lot of that tech, but the bike is unavailable without it, that is certainly going to drive the price of the bike up from what it would have been without that tech. But these are all electronics. Some people do worry that these electronics also have more failure conditions because unlike something that's mechanical that you might be able to repair if you have a failure in your cruise control system, which is a fully electronic or any of the sensors that are integrated into it, it's hard for shade tree mechanic to actually repair some of those. Now, the other thing that actually adds into the price of motorcycles are things like fairings and stereos and luggage. And this is really going to be more predicated towards that more touring type of motorcycle. And this could be a cruiser style touring bike. It could be a sport touring type of a bike or even an adventure touring type of bike. Many of those will have where they have more of a fairing and or a windscreen onto the onto the bike as well as luggage that's available. And if you look at some of the price differences into here, it's pretty clear if you were to look at, let's say the Harley Low rider s that does have the Milwaukee 117, if you look at a Street Glide, which adds the fairings and the saddlebags, their price difference goes from about$20,000 from that low rider S to about $25,000 for the Street Glide. So you're paying a $5,000 premium for that fairing and for that luggage on that particular bike. Similar prices you'd find, for example, for an Indian chief versus a chieftain or something like a R18 bagger versus the R18.
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But the reality is that the largest determinant of price is really displacement. And as we've been growing in terms of the motorcycle size, in terms of the engine size, it continued to go up so that Milwaukee 117 that I mentioned with the Harley Low Rider S and the Street Glide, this is a nearly 1900 CC engine.
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And it is driving the prices up.
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For example, think of Honda's Navi, which is their lowest cost bike. It's 109 CCs and it costs$2,000 for the bike. So you can buy a bike for a very low dollar amount. You just have to be willing to go for a bit of a lower CC. And if we think of the smallest Harley today is 975 cc's with the Nightster and that's going to be about $12,000.
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So you can get the lower capacity bikes and pay a little bit lower per ticket. But most of the big bikes from like Harley, Indian they're nearly two liters and they're going to cost at least $15,000 for like an Indian chief or a BMW R18 for that large sized bike. But I'd like to know, what do you think?
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What are the biggest drivers of prices today? Text the show through the link in the show notes and we'll share your feedback in a future episode.
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But are prices are really higher than they once were. Well, in truth, equivalent capacity bikes are actually cheaper than they once were. And what I mean by that is I'll give a couple of examples. So the first motorcycle that I ever owned, was actually a 1997 BMW, F650GS, and I bought that brand new back in 1997 and it cost $7,500 back then. And this was the entry level model in BMW's line and had a whopping 50 horsepower.
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Now, that same bike today, if we were to just think of inflation, would be about $11,000 in terms of its cost. So think of a bike that costs about $11,000. Well, today, BMW's entry point.
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They've actually gone an even smaller capacity. You can get the G310GS and this can be bought for $5,700. It has 34 horsepower. The current 2024 BMW F800GS has 87 horsepower and costs ten and a half thousand dollars. So it's essentially the equivalent dollars as I paid in 1997 for that F650GS. But I can get a bike with nearly 40 more horsepower or almost twice the horsepower or I could get G310GS and pay nearly half and just lose about 20 horsepower with the G310GS versus that F650GS.
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So if we think of equivalent capacity bikes, they are still cheaper for what you're getting.
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Similarly, if we think of a Harley, like look at the shovel heads that were around in the eighties, they were around 13 to 1400 ccs through the mid-eighties and made about 65 horsepower. And that was the big engine you could get back then.
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Well, today, the smallest or next to second smallest bike that you can get from Harley today, that's a similar engine capacity would be like the Sportster s and this is a 1250 CC engine, so a slightly smaller capacity than what you had of the biggest engines back then.
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But it produces more power.
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Instead of 65 horsepower, it's producing 121 horsepower. So it's almost double the horsepower with a similar engine configuration, actually still a little bit smaller. So you can still find some of these bargains. we can compare there is a brand or a couple of brands actually, where they make the same exact bike that they have done for many years. And the one that actually I looked at is what inspired me when I first loved getting into motorcycles.
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Dual sports was really the thing I enjoyed. That's why I got my BMW back then. I looked at the Honda XR650L and in 1992 is when that bike first came out. And in that 1992 model year, the MSRP was$4,349. Now you can buy the exact same bike in 2024 the XR650L from Honda for $7,000.
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And you say, well, but that's more expensive. But if you think of 4390 in $49 in 1992 would be the equivalent of $9,800 today.
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So the price has actually gone down by nearly 30% for the same bike. Ultimately, the thing that's really driving the price changes that we're seeing isn't when you're comparing the same bike versus what it was 25, 30 years ago, even ten years ago.
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What you're really looking at is that the displacement of the flagship models has continued to climb, and this is keeping the prices climbing up there. And because marketing pushes us so much to believe that we need to have the biggest, the most powerful bike out there. There's an urge that we say that's what we're comparing. And so when the prices of those are going up naturally, as they do from all the tech, from being a higher displacement, that's why it feels like bike prices are going up. The reality is that you don't need that much engine capacity for most any motorcycle on the road today. You've got more than enough power, you've got more than enough acceleration. You're going to out accelerate almost any other car that's on the road today, maybe save a couple of EVs and that will still perform better and it will be cheaper than an equivalent bike was many, many years ago.
00:24:55.479 --> 00:24:59.528
So let's wrap this up.
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Riders tend to think that bikes are getting more expensive and a lot of advanced tech is contributing to those increasing prices. Adding features we never thought we needed or wanted. And displacement, though, continues to be the biggest predictor of price, and the push to bigger bikes is helping to increase the average selling price. But bargains are still to be found.
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If you look at similar capacity bikes or bikes with similar performance, for example, the Royal Enfield line, as I mentioned before it, that's a hugely economical option and you get some great looking bikes.
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They're not the highest performance, but they're more than enough for you to get around on the road for a lot less. And the thing is, where I think is important for us to compare is in general for the same kind of tech tech prices and everything goes down over time for the same capability. So let me give a good example. Flat screen TVs In 2014, if you wanted to get a 50 inch flat panel, it would cost you about 1500 dollars back then. Today, it's really easy to find a screen that big for less than$250. So it's signifier greatly cheaper. Now, if you think of that and say, well, back then maybe a 50 inch was a large screen TV back then and therefore that's what I'm comparing to. And maybe you say, well, let me look at a hundred inch screen today, which should be on the upper end. Yes. The dollar amount of that 100 inch screen is much more, but it's also twice the screen diagonal size. So you're getting a lot more for that. It is the premium product now, but that's because it's just been upsized and upsized and upsized. If you compare the same thing to what you had before, the price is actually lower now, maybe not to the extreme that we have in flat panels of not getting a bike that was $15,000 and now spending 2500 on it today. But it is still generally cheaper than it was before. But I'd love to know what you think. Do you think that prices are too much?
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Do you feel that you need to have that top of the line model and that's why the prices are feeling so much higher? Text the show through the link in the show notes and we'll share your feedback in a future episode.
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Thanks so much for listening.
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We'll see you next time.
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